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  #111  
Old 09-20-2013
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peteaeonix peteaeonix is offline
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PVC is considered stable for use in most types of chemicals -- from the PVC.Org Web site:

(quote)
Oil/Chemical resistance
PVC is resistant to acid, alkali and almost all inorganic chemicals. Although PVC swells or dissolves in aromatic hydrocarbons, ketones, and cyclic ethers, PVC is hard to dissolve in other organic solvents. Taking advantage of this characteristic, PVC is used in exhaust gas ducts, sheets used in construction, bottles, tubes and hoses.
(end quote)

Note that gasoline and diesel fuel containers ("jerry cans") are generally made from PVC. For more information, see: http://www.pvc.org/en/p/pvcs-physical-properties

I tried the commercial "donut" thing, but the first time I used one, the fuel dispenser did not shut off promptly and the donut was soaked. I then had the problem of how to store it so that it didn't get diesel odor everywhere. I ended up tossing it out, instead of putting it in the basement storage. At $2.00 each, I decided that a rag would do as well... and would cost less. (After 40 years of marriage, we have tons of old towels that have been "converted" to use as rags.) The rag as proven quite sufficient.

I wanted to use the PVC pipe, but I also preferred to use the truck pumps, as the entry/exit is often much superior to the RV pumps at some stations. (One Flying J in Wyoming had a near-impossible turn to enter/leave their RV pumps ... which I discovered on my maiden trip, when I was least able to deal with such challenges. No paint was scraped, but there was a lot of back and forth to get the 'bird out of that pump area.)

This brings up the question, do "high speed" truck stop nozzles fit inside the Sched 40 PVC pipe? I wasn't certain that would be the case, using 1-1/2" PVC, so I never installed the inner pipe on my 'bird.

I found that (1) wrapping a terry cloth rag loosely around the filler nozzle wound contain and minimize the splash back bath. And (2) operating the dispenser at its lowest speed setting minimized the size of the splash back. (3) If I held the nozzle up (from the bottom), then that would maximize fuel flow on the bottom of the filler pipe and allow more air to escape from the tank as it is filling. (I note that #3 is a bit tedious and can tire out your arm -- but if the fuel tank was quite low, I could hold off lifting the nozzle until the tank was about 2/3 full.)

One factor is that the fuel that's delivered can be more or less foamy. I never was able to correlate any obvious factors (time of day/temperature) to the "foaminess" of the fuel -- but I did notice that those times when fuel was not foaming as it entered the filler pipe, that I could generally run the pump at a higher speed and not get blow back at shut off. Dispensers that delivered particularly foamy diesel might require holding the nozzle up throughout the complete fueling process.

Finally, I learned to stand well to one side of the fuel filler when fueling. I also wore rubber gloves during the process. A spare rag hanging out of one of my pockets was often useful if there was some minor spillage or if my hand (glove) got overly wet from fuel.

Most of the problem with fueling 'birds has to do with the rather long filler pipe to reach the tank (located in the center of the coach). With such a long pipe, it is easy for the fuel entering the tank to surge down the pipe in a way that exiting air is trapped inside, eventually causing the "burp."

I note that my Sprinter van has a rather short filler pipe. In contrast, it does not "burp" -- but some (defective) filler nozzles aren't as quick at shutting off as needed, and I've occasionally had a minor spill (my hand never leaves the nozzle, so I can quickly shut it off). The Wanderlodge shower never occurs, but sometimes I get a mess running down the side of the van.
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  #112  
Old 09-20-2013
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isp2952 isp2952 is online now
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I don't care how fast or slow you put fuel in a coach it is going to foam. I have a tank at home that I use to fill my tractor and it has a hand pump. So it pumps as slow as you can possibly get and it still foams up. It is just the nature of the product. Obviously it will foam more if you really put it in full speed, but I put the fuel in slow and use the rag method, along with opening up the other side to help let the air out. So far so good.
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  #113  
Old 09-20-2013
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Michael,
Your points are well taken, and to the point... But you have to deal with the problem at hand before you come up with a solution, I find the collar a good way to keep the fuel off of you and your coach and the environment!!!
Until there is a solution for the problem I think taking the collar and using it, keep it in a plastic bag, when you get home clean it and use it again!!!



Quote:
Originally Posted by rtpn60 View Post
The problem with a fuel collar is that they address the symptom not the problem, it's an additional expense, storage, and process I don't want to deal with, and you still have a fuel soaked, messy thing to dispose of. Some would even argue that a fuel soaked rag in the trash is a hazard itself.

I'd be more interested in a solution to address the poor design we have, even to the point of removing and re-engineering, or even relocating the filler tube itself.
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  #114  
Old 09-20-2013
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Turbokitty Turbokitty is offline
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Stupid comment but...
have any of ya'll noticed how fountain soda drinks don't foam hardly at all but out of a 2 liter bottle etc. the soda foams like crazy? Too bad they can't do the same with diesel, har!

FWIW, I just wrap a paper towel around the nozzle and stuff a portion of it along with the nozzle down the 'ol fill hole. Keeps any "burp" from getting all over me, boy did I learn that the hard way the first time I filled up the FC back in '06, came up like a bad lunch, all over me!

(BTW, there is a Spock explanation to the soda thingy)
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  #115  
Old 09-22-2013
George Roberts George Roberts is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Randy Dupree View Post
I just pump slowly...
I HAVE to pump slowly or it burps and wastes fuel. The previous owner had put some kind of a pipe thing in there to help, but I think that was a waste of money.
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  #116  
Old 09-22-2013
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Come on guys just slow down, we’re not driving Indy cars and we don’t need to make a vital scheduled delivery or are you guys using your bird to transport contraband and need to speed away from the law. The problem is the high volume fuel pumps and the lower intake spouts we have on our birds, maybe your tank vent is crusted over and that is part of the problem. Air is in the tank when your need to fill up and that fuel your pumping in is displacing the air in the tank and air & fuel cannot occupy the same space at the same time so that is why you get burping of fuel. I use the extra pipe method and that works for me, it may not work for you, but it does for me & when I’m too lazy to walk up to the storage compartment to fetch it I know I have to pump SLOWLY or risk the chance in taking a diesel bath. With the pipe method fuel flows through the pipe into the tank and the air in the tank escapes around it out the fuel spout. When I use the pipe method very seldom do I ever have to worry about splash back? When I do get splash-back it is always 100% my fault and not the bird and not the pump. Stop by my bird at WOG or any rally and I will be glad to show it to you, it works. I don’t need a rag, a cone or paper towel. I do wear disposable gloves because one drop of diesel will linger around for a week.
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  #117  
Old 09-24-2013
cire cire is offline
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In the early days of my life with the bird foaming over was a common occurrence. I solved the problem quite a few years ago by filling slowly and more importantly calculating before filling how many gallons the bird will consume. I'll fill the bottom 3/4 of the tank at high speed, then I go to slow fill. I will take a flashlight and look into the tank on the other side from where I am filling. When the foam reaches the bottom/middle of my fill nozzle I stop filling and let the foam die. Usually about two minutes. I resume filling with my flashlight in hand. I often have to stop a second time to let the foam die. If my wife is handy I'll put her on the pump and man my flashlight on the other side. When the fuel on the other side of the pump rises to cover the bottom of the fill pipe, I stop filling. Perhaps I could squeeze another 10 or 20 gallons in but that means flirting with getting a foam bath. Boy its great having a 300 gallon tank even if I don't fill it to the tip top.
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