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General Discussion of preventative/corrective maintenance and other technical issues regarding your coach that are not covered in other Mechanic's Corner categories (ex. refrigerators, water heaters, and compressors).

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  #11  
Old 06-17-2014
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There is a bit of difference between coating a bolt before inserting it vs using a penetrant to remove a seized bolt. It certainly makes sense that acetone would improve the latter, as it did in the Drexel University test.

If you Google "liquid wrench kano kroil acetone" You will see how the list is always identical to what you posted, and is just about everywhere. It is even on Wikipedia, but the source listed there is a hotrodder forum that quotes it as being in Machinist's Magazine, just like all of the others who quote a source.

I ran into this, here: http://www.forums.woodnet.net/ubbthr...2&Main=6760278
Quote:
If you track back the postings on the web, they converge on a single posting in February 2007. It seems suspicious that this is prior to the claimed date of publication. This article has essentially achieved urban legend status.
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  #12  
Old 06-17-2014
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OK, digging deep enough I did find that the article is apparently real, although the various postings may alter things somewhat. This is a post from the George Bulliss, the editor of the magazine in question, posted 3/28/2011 at http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net/thr...299#post654299

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I get more mail about this one little article than any of the others we have printed. Almost all of the mail relates to the fact that the two ingredients in the homemade penetrant do not mix. The fact that the photo in the magazine shows a container of Power Steering Fluid, while the text refers to Automatic Transmission Fluid, has also spurred more than a few people to call or write.

The author was kind enough to write a reply to these questions and it appeared in the February/March 2010 issue of Machinist’s Workshop. The following is Lloyd W. Bender’s reply:

The original homemade penetrating oil mixture called for using trichloroethelyne as the solvent. I cannot recommend trichlor for home shop use and definitely not for anything slightly resembling a business. Both PSF and ATF will form emulsions with acetone under mild agitation sufficient to thin the oil enough to penetrate. Upon standing, these will separate. Acetone performs better than the other commonly available organic solvents, such as methanol, but not as well as trichlor.
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  #13  
Old 06-17-2014
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So somebody needs to conduct an experiment using straight beeswax vs a mixture of beeswax and acetone
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  #14  
Old 06-17-2014
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Gawler Car Club Magazine Dec 2013 reported that this ATF Acetone concoction was retested by these folks......"(This very interesting article on penetrating oil that can be made at home and its effectiveness was reproduced from ‘Steering Column ‘April 2013, the official monthly newsletter of the Historic Motor Vehicles Club Inc., of Victor Harbor SA. ) "
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  #15  
Old 06-17-2014
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Once again the HMVC article only references the Machinist's Magazine article, with just the note "we all now use it with equally good results" - doesn't say they did any actual testing themselves.

Amazing how one article that reported tests, using ingredients that weren't actually used in the tests, and becomes the authority around the world on what works and what does not.

This is not a knock on whether ATF/Acetone works; I assume it does. I just have trouble with the concept of locking relative numbers in stone based on a single tester who used PSF and trichlorethylene but ascribes the numerical result to ATF/Acetone.
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  #16  
Old 06-17-2014
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I've tried the beeswax and have yet to have success with it. A couple months ago I had the pleasure of trying to remove 8 bolts that hold the turbo onto my loader, they had never been removed since 1984, 2 came out with lots of PB and some choice words, the other 6 I ended up torching the heads off, they were not even hexagonal anymore and nothing would grab them. This left 1/4" nubs sticking up above the manifold, I heated the nubs, I heated the manifold, I hammered and I cursed, they refused to budge. My final solution was making "wells" out of round stock, these were rtv'd over the nubs and filled with vinegar and allowed to soak for 2 to 3 days (vinegar is great for de-rusting), then compressed air was used to blow the vinegar out of the wells and they were re-filled with a 50/50 acetone/atf mix and allowed to soak for another 24 hours. After the wells were removed I tried grabbing the nubs with vise grips, they still did not move, so I set nuts over them and welded the nuts to the nubs, allowed them to cool and they spun right out, 6 for 6. They might have come out just by welding the nuts on, I'll never know, I will say the threads were clean when removed.
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  #17  
Old 06-17-2014
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When it comes to gripping rounded off bolt heads, I have found that a pipe wrench can usually get a grip on them and move them. Just be careful that you don't twist it off flush with the mounting surface.
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  #18  
Old 06-17-2014
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stick Miller View Post
I use a toilet ring cut into small sections for lubricating wood screws. Wonder if the properties are similar enough so that the ring would work on this situation?
Stick--

I learned as a kid to drive big nails by first dipping them in bacon grease. Do ya think a screw would drive easier into wood with grease or wax?

Wax is nature's waterproofing--plants and insects commonly have a wax that blocks evaporation so they don't need water all the time. People secrete a wax called sebum.

Anyway, since wax is so good at blocking moisture, I'd bet (not a lot) that the ring is predominantly wax. 100%?
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  #19  
Old 06-17-2014
spottrouble spottrouble is offline
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Joatha
There was no room for a pipe wrench, not even the little 6"er.

Stick & Nbedinger
Pretty sure toilet rings are still beeswax, they used to be....
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  #20  
Old 06-17-2014
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Do the taste test; should taste like honey.

Quote:
Originally Posted by spottrouble View Post
Joatha
There was no room for a pipe wrench, not even the little 6"er.

Stick & Nbedinger
Pretty sure toilet rings are still beeswax, they used to be....
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