Diesel fuel in oil ISL 400 Cummins

[Alan]

Did Cummins use this fuel pump in the LX's?

[DonB]

No. I have not seen a description of exactly how the systems differ, but the ISM used a fuel system called CM570 until 2002, when it was replaced by CM875.

The 1998-2002 ISC and ISL engines used the system we are talking about, called CAPS (Cummins Accumlator Pump System) with each injector controlled at the pump. In 2003 they came out with an HPCR (High Pressure Common Rail) system, eliminating a lot of the pump components. All M380s that I'm aware of have 2002 engines (not sure about the rare late-model M380s).

[DonB]

Some quick reading indicates that the CM570 was used in both the ISM and the ISX until 2002, and is described as "Integrated Fuel System Module (IFSM) with a lift pump, gear pump, pressure regulators, shutoff valve, metering and timing actuators to deliver fuel to the injectors."

That sounds very much like the CAPS system, but is apparently a different model.

[RonC]

I wish we had some comprehensive statistics about how serious these problems are. We may be a relatively small cohort in a much larger population. If the problem is widespread...a ticking bomb...we may have to pay some to take these coaches off our hands if we decide to sell.

Anyone have an idea on who to ask about the number of pump and gasket failures annually? If it is indeed a widespread issue there may be some recourse.

We are enjoying the RV experience but have decided that we really like boating better and plan to head back that way. We'll see.

[Dc2x4drvr]

The head gasket issue has been pretty well covered on the WOG, and there is list of members who reported failures, Cummins has said that they're not going to warranty RV engines out of warranty.
Cummins did introduce a new fuel pump accumulator in 2006, that was designed to prevent fuel leak ieaking into the crankcase, so obviously there was a problem, however how many of our fuel pumps were modified before the warranty ran out is the question.
The pump was designed when Cummins was moving from mechanical to electronic control so apparently the design wasn't perfect. And since Cummins moved on to new engine families we're stuck with Recon parts instead of new..
just my .02

[DonB]

Lance, I wasn't aware of the design change, hopefully it is incorporated into the rebuilds, although that particular problem (leakage into the crankcase) is not one I've experienced with any of my pumps.

While it was certainly no fun while I was going through all of my pump tribulations, I don't think the pump problem is as major as one might think reading this thread. Yes, some pumps fail, and it is a sore point that such a high percentage of rebuilds fail quickly. It appears likely, though, that just as with the head gasket it is not a universal problem.

There isn't even a universal problem with the failed pumps. A couple here have had the crankcase leakage problem. I've had two different problems - the first was an external leak, and the second was a failure of a completely different component, not on the pump, that took out the pump's electronics.

So far I'm not seeing anybody who has been through this and come out the other side with a "good" rebuild who has had a second failure.

Because there are a lot of these pumps in transit buses of the era there is some data out on the net that indicates the MTBF for the pumps is somewhere in the neighborhood of 4000 engine hours. If that is true, the ones you read about here are outliers - my current one is 1745 hours and the SOB was a lot less. Not something that alarms me, even if I was gnashing my teeth this past fall!

[RonC]

Originally Posted by DonB

Not something that alarms me, even if I was gnashing my teeth this past fall!

I totally agree. This is the fourth Cummins mechanical engine that I have owned. I am lucky to have a very trusted Cummins mechanic and he tells me how to treat the mechanical engines. It involves a little VooDoo so I will keep it to myself.

Whatever will be will be...and...many years ago when I lived in Houston I watched Howard Hughes's funeral on live TV. I kept looking for an armored car behind the hearse but it was not there.

[Scott White]

Went by the Shop today and they said a New Pump is listed at $6200 but none are in stock in the Systems. They said they Could order it but it Could take a month or so. I told them to get another rebuilt pump, hopefully this One will be a good one. You would Think they would have better quality control For a Pump in the $4,000 range. Maybe my original was not in the recall and this One will last much longer. Other option would be to try to put a DD 60 in it.

[DonB]

I'll bet the New Pump in the listings is simply a vestigial listing from times gone by - never to be filled, no matter how many times it gets ordered.

[Scott White]

I agree, this will about the same Price as What it cost on the Old GM Diesel pick-ups if you got water in the fuel.