Wanderlodge Owners Group  
BuyByeBlueBird.com
Donate

Go Back   Wanderlodge Owners Group > Mechanic's Corner > HVAC, Air Conditioners, Aqua Hot, Primus, Webasto, Chassis Heaters, Furnaces and Water Heaters

HVAC, Air Conditioners, Aqua Hot, Primus, Webasto, Chassis Heaters, Furnaces and Water Heaters Questions and information about the wide variety of Heating and Air Conditioning as well as Water Heater systems available are discussed here.

Site Search:
Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #41  
Old 12-28-2018
rshrimp rshrimp is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Myakka City
Posts: 1,498
Default

" The Eaton SPST rocker switch is rated for 16 amps 250 VAC, I have not been able to convert this to a 12 VDC rating, but I suspect it will not meet the run current load of 7.8 amps, although it has conducted the load so far without failing. Switch life could become a problem"

Amps and Volts don't convert. Think of the 2 ratings a seperate.

1.The switch can handle up to 16 amps before it fries the contacts. (This has to do with wire size or the size of the contacts. Voltage is not considered)

2. The switch can handle up to 250vac before it jumps the contacts with an arc.( This has to do with the spacing of the contacts when the switch is open. Amps are not considered)

The only weak point I see based on your description is the 10amp fuse. Normally you want 1.5x to 2x the normal load. If it stops working after a time and blows the fuse I would go back to a 15amp

If you have a significant voltage drop do to wire run length a relay could be added but I would not do it just to take the load off one set of contacts (switch) and put it on another set of contacts (relay)
__________________
Randy and Sonya Shrimplin
FMCA# F457849
Livin' the dream, next door to the Drysdale's in Beverly Hills FL!
87 FC35 "Old School"
RShrimp@Yahoo.com
Reply With Quote
  #42  
Old 12-28-2018
Randy Dupree's Avatar
Randy Dupree Randy Dupree is offline
Forum owner
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Port St Joe,Fl
Posts: 35,884
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by rshrimp View Post
" The Eaton SPST rocker switch is rated for 16 amps 250 VAC, I have not been able to convert this to a 12 VDC rating, but I suspect it will not meet the run current load of 7.8 amps, although it has conducted the load so far without failing. Switch life could become a problem"

Amps and Volts don't convert. Think of the 2 ratings a seperate.

1.The switch can handle up to 16 amps before it fries the contacts. (This has to do with wire size or the size of the contacts. Voltage is not considered)

2. The switch can handle up to 250vac before it jumps the contacts with an arc.( This has to do with the spacing of the contacts when the switch is open. Amps are not considered)

The only weak point I see based on your description is the 10amp fuse. Normally you want 1.5x to 2x the normal load. If it stops working after a time and blows the fuse I would go back to a 15amp

If you have a significant voltage drop do to wire run length a relay could be added but I would not do it just to take the load off one set of contacts (switch) and put it on another set of contacts (relay)

I never thought about the voltage jumping the contacts,thanks for that reply Randy.
__________________
DO NOT SEND PM
email me at randy@randydupree.com only.

Randy Dupree
2000 LXI 43
Bainbridge,Ga.
Port St Joe Fl.
www.buybyebluebird.com

randy@randydupree.com
Reply With Quote
  #43  
Old 12-28-2018
Jim Brookshire Jim Brookshire is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Saluda, NC
Posts: 1,231
Default

There is a difference between AC and DC in the problem of arcing when the circuit is broken. The exact difference is beyond my pay grade. I think it is a bigger problem with DC.
__________________
Jim Brookshire
2001 LXI
Saluda, NC
Reply With Quote
  #44  
Old 12-28-2018
Flyfisher Flyfisher is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Beverly Hills
Posts: 544
Default

Thanks to all for the replies, this is how it wound up. I satisfied myself the switch would be okay and comfortably carry the load. Arcing would not be a problem because I will never turn the dash switch off under load while the diesel burner is operating as a routine, only in an emergency condition. The controller needs to shutdown the burner, purge and then go to standby in response to the control thermostat reaching its set point and stopping the enable signal. What bothered me after the switch situation is the dash wiring, it is small maybe 18 awg maybe smaller. Lifted the dash again and opened up the front nose panel to try and trace the wires, but its conglomeration of countless bundled wires. The dash switch wire bundle goes to one of the cannon plugs where it transitions to 14 awg on the opposite plug. This small wire size just bothers me having had a 1974 Grand Prix burn to the ground from an electrical fire back in '79, so I have a healthy respect, call it fear of electricity and I didn't sleep in the car either. So, I isolated the main power feed circuit from the dash switch circuit with another relay, so much for the KISS principal, but what about that principal applies to a Blue Bird anyway? Thanks for bringing this up Randy when responding to Dick, don't know why I overlooked it when I changed my dash switch to resolve a voltage drop. Maybe the LXI has a relay in the dash switch circuit already, Dick you'll have to figure that out, but my WB did not. End of story.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0991.jpg
Views:	60
Size:	190.0 KB
ID:	59687  
Attached Files
File Type: pdf Aqua Hot Wiring Diagram.pdf (385.6 KB, 47 views)
__________________


Andy & Jean Harmon
Dakota (our Aussie traveling buddy)
Beverly Hills, FL
1996 WB42 (SOLD)
Reply With Quote
  #45  
Old 12-28-2018
CaptPegLeg CaptPegLeg is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Kitty Hawk
Posts: 910
Default

I don’t have a Webasto,yet, so I don’t officially have a dog in this fight but on behalf of those that do...THANKS FOR THE TIME AND THOUGHT THAT WENT INTO THAT DIAGRAM.
__________________

Bob Sumners
1993 WB
1983 PT35 Sold
Reply With Quote
  #46  
Old 01-15-2019
giderich's Avatar
giderich giderich is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Rolla
Posts: 3,119
Default Relay provides 12 volts to Beckett Controller

After installing new bearings in the blower housing, fuel solenoid rebuild kit, new fuel pump, nozzle riser and new Sauer Danfoss nozzle, the Webasto burner showed signs of low rpms along with some black smoke.

Again, following Andy's lead, I installed a 30 amp automotive relay toggled by the new dash switch provided by Dupree Products and no more voltage drop along with zero smoke. Voltage measured at the input pin to the Beckett Controller is now a solid 13.25 volts with the blower motor/fuel pump running.

The purge cycle following burner shutoff by the control thermostat lasted exactly 2 minutes as called for in the specs.

See a couple of pics of temporary wiring job to the 30 amp relay.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyfisher View Post
Thanks to all for the replies, this is how it wound up. I satisfied myself the switch would be okay and comfortably carry the load. Arcing would not be a problem because I will never turn the dash switch off under load while the diesel burner is operating as a routine, only in an emergency condition. The controller needs to shutdown the burner, purge and then go to standby in response to the control thermostat reaching its set point and stopping the enable signal. What bothered me after the switch situation is the dash wiring, it is small maybe 18 awg maybe smaller. Lifted the dash again and opened up the front nose panel to try and trace the wires, but its conglomeration of countless bundled wires. The dash switch wire bundle goes to one of the cannon plugs where it transitions to 14 awg on the opposite plug. This small wire size just bothers me having had a 1974 Grand Prix burn to the ground from an electrical fire back in '79, so I have a healthy respect, call it fear of electricity and I didn't sleep in the car either. So, I isolated the main power feed circuit from the dash switch circuit with another relay, so much for the KISS principal, but what about that principal applies to a Blue Bird anyway? Thanks for bringing this up Randy when responding to Dick, don't know why I overlooked it when I changed my dash switch to resolve a voltage drop. Maybe the LXI has a relay in the dash switch circuit already, Dick you'll have to figure that out, but my WB did not. End of story.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	HPIM3868.jpg
Views:	78
Size:	188.2 KB
ID:	59856   Click image for larger version

Name:	HPIM3870.jpg
Views:	76
Size:	197.8 KB
ID:	59857  
__________________
Dick & Patsy Gideon
1999 43 LXI Single Slide Body # F124510
2005 JEEP Liberty Limited CRD (diesel Toad)
SOLD 89 FC in 2012; SOLD 88 WB in 2016
Rolla, MO 65401
Reply With Quote
  #47  
Old 01-15-2019
Flyfisher Flyfisher is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Beverly Hills
Posts: 544
Default

I’ve been wondering about you Dick, glad to hear your project was successful.
__________________


Andy & Jean Harmon
Dakota (our Aussie traveling buddy)
Beverly Hills, FL
1996 WB42 (SOLD)
Reply With Quote
  #48  
Old 06-13-2019
Bikeboy57 Bikeboy57 is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Inverness
Posts: 28
Default

Thanks Andy and Dick for being the pioneers, and taking the time to post the schematic. I made this mod on our coach to replace a finicky Webasto controller.

I want to add to this thread a couple of things for others making the mod to think about. used the existing ignition coil only because it was still working.

One, looking at Andy’s schematic, you will need to tap into the temp control thermostat and the high limit thermostat that are buried in boiler housing. If you just want to splice into those snap action thermostats, then orange and white are the leads for the temp control tstat, and light blue and light purple are the leads for the high limit thermostat.

Second, given that the main power lead for the Beckett goes through the on/off switch and the hi limit thermostat, I decided to use that wiring to activate a relay to minimize the potential of voltage drop to the Beckett.

Three, as Andy did, I rewired the motor, fuel solenoid, igniter, and flame sensor. The wiring to the motor, fuel solenoid, and flame sensor is ridiculously undersized. It was also extremely brittle after twenty years of use. I used 14g for the motor and 16g for all the others. I sourced high temp silicone jacketed wire from Amazon. It’s a pain to take the blower case apart, but after what I saw I am glad I did.

After a week of testing, the intermittent behavior of the AH is no longer. I am happy with the outcome. Thanks to the pioneers for providing an alternative.
__________________
Bikeboy57
Richard and Rhonda Entrekin
Inverness, Florida when we're home
99 Newell with DD Series 60
Subaru Outback toad
Reply With Quote
  #49  
Old 06-13-2019
giderich's Avatar
giderich giderich is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Rolla
Posts: 3,119
Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bikeboy57 View Post
Thanks Andy and Dick for being the pioneers, and taking the time to post the schematic. I made this mod on our coach to replace a finicky Webasto controller.

I want to add to this thread a couple of things for others making the mod to think about. used the existing ignition coil only because it was still working.

One, looking at Andy’s schematic, you will need to tap into the temp control thermostat and the high limit thermostat that are buried in boiler housing. If you just want to splice into those snap action thermostats, then orange and white are the leads for the temp control tstat, and light blue and light purple are the leads for the high limit thermostat.

Second, given that the main power lead for the Beckett goes through the on/off switch and the hi limit thermostat, I decided to use that wiring to activate a relay to minimize the potential of voltage drop to the Beckett.

Three, as Andy did, I rewired the motor, fuel solenoid, igniter, and flame sensor. The wiring to the motor, fuel solenoid, and flame sensor is ridiculously undersized. It was also extremely brittle after twenty years of use. I used 14g for the motor and 16g for all the others. I sourced high temp silicone jacketed wire from Amazon. It’s a pain to take the blower case apart, but after what I saw I am glad I did.

After a week of testing, the intermittent behavior of the AH is no longer. I am happy with the outcome. Thanks to the pioneers for providing an alternative.
Richard, thanks for posting your modification to the AquaHot / Webasto burner on your 99 Newell. Keep in touch and let us know how the Beckett 12VDC controller performs over time. Mine is working as designed so far with no complaints.

We crossed paths last fall when we parked next to you at the Cabellas Corporate CG in Sydney NB, and visited briefly before we headed eastbound on I-80...small world.
__________________
Dick & Patsy Gideon
1999 43 LXI Single Slide Body # F124510
2005 JEEP Liberty Limited CRD (diesel Toad)
SOLD 89 FC in 2012; SOLD 88 WB in 2016
Rolla, MO 65401
Reply With Quote
  #50  
Old 06-20-2019
Bikeboy57 Bikeboy57 is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Inverness
Posts: 28
Default

I failed to mention something about this modification. My hat is off to Andy for something very clever that he noodled out about the wiring on this modification. His use of the relay to turn the indicator light out if the unit faults was straightforward, but his jumper on the indicator light in conjunction with the ground interrupt through a NC relay terminal was sheer circuit genius. I just wanted to give him a public kudo for a bit of brilliance that was hidden deep in the details of this modification.
__________________
Bikeboy57
Richard and Rhonda Entrekin
Inverness, Florida when we're home
99 Newell with DD Series 60
Subaru Outback toad
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Snap Action Resettable 12vdc Circuit Breakers rrueckwald Electrical 10 12-05-2018 10:52 PM
Aqua Hot Zone Heater Fan Speed Controller Kev HVAC, Air Conditioners, Aqua Hot, Primus, Webasto, Chassis Heaters, Furnaces and Water Heaters 3 11-08-2017 07:46 PM
1991 WLSP 12VDC 120VAC Build Sheets nbedinger SP (Single Axle Pusher Unique Issues) 28 11-16-2016 12:39 PM
adding 20amp 12VDC line gkempse Electrical 0 11-17-2009 10:22 PM
12VDC roof crane,free, must pick up robertakins Parts and Other Items For Sale 1 06-02-2008 11:39 PM

Web Search:

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 02:25 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions Inc.