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Electrical Discussion of preventative/corrective maintenance and other technical issues regarding your coach's electrical system.

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  #81  
Old 01-09-2013
Bill Pape's Avatar
Bill Pape Bill Pape is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GreenBird View Post
7764 is the number - they are made by several different manufacturers using plastic or metal shells. I believe the Hart brand is the most compact and durable - see post #70 of this thread for a picture of the original.
thanks Leonard
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  #82  
Old 01-09-2013
Clueless Clueless is offline
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One of the 4 cords that came with mine is just what is being described...30A male, 50A red taped female that plugs right into the 50A connection on the bus.

If we already have a 50A cord, just a cheapo dog bone will plug into a 30A receptacle and the 50A cord will plug into that. These 2 items are almost all we need on board. The other 3 cords that came with the bus are not needed in our case.
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  #83  
Old 06-15-2019
ChrisRasman ChrisRasman is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iamflagman View Post
It seems that there are different configurations of power cords that have eventually ended up in our 'Birds, some came from the factory and some were made up out of necessity by the previous owners and unfortunately especially for the NEWBY it can be very confusing, if there is no documentation that came with their new to them 'Bird. what I will try to do here is explain as best as I can the differences in the shore power cords and related equipment that came with my 'Bird and that I have ended up purchasing or making for my 'Bird.

My 'Bird came with a 50 amp power cord and it has "6/3 8/1 FOR MOBILE HOME USE" molded into the rubber covering, with the female twist lock end that attachés to the 'Bird and the 4 prong male plug that attachés to the 50 amp shore power receptacle, it also came with two 30 amp cords, with female twist lock ends that attach to the 'Bird and 3 prong male plugs that attach to the shore power 30 amp receptacle.



http://upload.pbase.com/iamflagman/image/91991466

I carry a 30 amp extension cord that I purchased at Wal Mart and I also built a 50 amp extension cord to carry with me.

http://www.pbase.com/image/97885543

Originally the two 30 amp cords were used to power the two separate sides of the breaker panel, or some people would connect the two 30 amp cords to separate 30 amp receptacles located close to each other, but I have removed the wiring for the two 30 amp receptacles on my 'Bird and now I use what is sometimes referred to as a DOG BONE adapter to attach my 50 amp electrical cord to a 30 amp campground receptacle.

http://www.tweetys.com/ProductImages...58404_silo.jpg

It splits the 30 amp so that it will power both sides of your breaker panel and they are available at most RV supply store and I have even seen them in the rv section of the automotive department at Wal mart, or you can purchase them online from places like http://www.tweetys.com/index.asp?Pag...OD&ProdID=7648

You will have to keep in mind that you will have to be more careful about power management when you use this, as it will not give you enough power on each leg to use everything, just look on your breaker panel and see what is locate on each side, to give you an idea of what you can use. I normally use my center roof airconditioner, the water heater and the battery charger and it seems to handle that load with no problem, however I have modified my 'Bird to operate the TV's, Satellite dish and receiver, two 14 inch fans and the microwave off of the inverter which is powered by eight Trojan golf cart batteries, the fans help to circulate the cold air.

I have heard of some 'Bird owners that have a longer extension cord made up similar to the adapter above, some with 50 amp style cords, or 30 amp style cords used with the appropriate ends attached.

Here is a source for the 50 amp female connector that goes into the 'Birds receptacle.
http://www.electric-supplier.com/pro...64_w324123.php
CONNECTOR: 600 VAC/250 VDC; 50 AMPERE; 3 POLE; 4 WIRE; GROUNDING; METAL SHELL; CORD SIZE 0.68 TO 1.125 INCH; APPROVAL UL, CSA; HART-LOCK[R] BRAND


RV Electric Service, Connections and Basic Information
Installing a 30 or 50-amp RV Electric Service Note: If you would like to install a SERVICE for your RV make sure you understand basic wiring. It is not that hard as long as you follow the rules.

Check out these posts by our forum members cheater precautions?? they can be found under Electrical


I was a CE (construction electrician) in the SEABEES and the grandson of a registered electrician. I grew up working for him. I know what the NEC is. What I am doing is a first and, I don't have the NEC to look at. I look on the WWW and get all sorts of bad info (I think). In one of the threads here I read, one who said one single phase 50 amp 110 breaker. Huh?

I have the same dry box as in this thread. My bird is coming home to roost in about a week. I have to lay down a 5 inch gravel drive and put in a gate this week. I have a 300 AMP panel in my home, so I have plenty of ampacity.




I found two wiring diagrams online that seem to support its a 220 2 phase 50 amp breaker feeding two 110 volts sides of the circuit with the neutral and ground bonded and feeding two of the four poles of the NEMA 14-50R, 3P, 4W Power Receptacle.

Click image for larger version

Name:	50 Amp RV outlet.jpg
Views:	36
Size:	98.1 KB
ID:	62478

Click image for larger version

Name:	14-50R.jpg
Views:	41
Size:	61.2 KB
ID:	62479

Now i admit to only looking at the power cable and the power pedestal at the dealer for a few seconds. If I am totally wrong on this I am sorry. I have tried to do my due diligence hunting around WOG and the WWW. I do have a portable Progressive surge protector and was going to go on my own. i just wanted to make sure I am 100% right before I do something stupid. Thanks.

I will post pics in my album later this week. I have a ton of things stockpiled waiting for the bird. TPMS, Multi traffic camera system and a Silverleaf VMSpc (and more) sitting. I have the dealer doing tires, air bags, and spring cans. They are meeting me half way with those. They did the radiator, and the hydronic heating system and I am grateful for that.

Future plan are a birds nest (this winter), slowly treating the rusty frame and sealing it. Solar and 100 Ah LiFePO4 12 Volt Deep Cycle house batteries. Safe T Plus steering control coming soon too.
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2003 Wanderlodge 40LX
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  #84  
Old 06-15-2019
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gcyeaw gcyeaw is online now
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Be very careful, especially with the 110 system, assuming what you find on the forum is correct. As with other things on the forum, it can be the posters belief and not necessarily be correct. There is tons of good information on the forum, but there is no official process to find and correct misinformation.

John Finn's (Iamflagman) posts as you copied can be trusted, he was very knowledgeable.
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  #85  
Old 06-15-2019
mahansm mahansm is offline
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Your diagram for wiring the 120/240 50a power receptacle is correct. However, if I were doing it (and I did...) I'd use #6 copper for the 2 hot leads and the neutral. The ground lead doesn't have to be any thicker than #12, although I ran #8 to the outlet on the side of my house (about 2 feet). The hot leads are connected to the terminals of a dual 50 amp 120 volt breaker; the ground and neutral both connect to the common bus in my service entry panel.



The neutral and ground conductors should only be bonded at the service entrance with driven ground rods. Any sub panel fed from the main panel should have separate ground and neutral buses. The neutral bus should be isolated from the box and the ground bus connected to the (metal) box.
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  #86  
Old 06-16-2019
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GreenBird GreenBird is offline
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6/3 8/1 identifies the cord as having three 6 gauge conductors and one 8 gauge conductor. It won’t help you with the plug.
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  #87  
Old 06-16-2019
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisRasman View Post
I was a CE (construction electrician) in the SEABEES and the grandson of a registered electrician. I grew up working for him. I know what the NEC is. What I am doing is a first and, I don't have the NEC to look at. I look on the WWW and get all sorts of bad info (I think). In one of the threads here I read, one who said one single phase 50 amp 110 breaker. Huh?

I have the same dry box as in this thread. My bird is coming home to roost in about a week. I have to lay down a 5 inch gravel drive and put in a gate this week. I have a 300 AMP panel in my home, so I have plenty of ampacity.




I found two wiring diagrams online that seem to support its a 220 2 phase 50 amp breaker feeding two 110 volts sides of the circuit with the neutral and ground bonded and feeding two of the four poles of the NEMA 14-50R, 3P, 4W Power Receptacle.

Attachment 62478

Attachment 62479

Now i admit to only looking at the power cable and the power pedestal at the dealer for a few seconds. If I am totally wrong on this I am sorry. I have tried to do my due diligence hunting around WOG and the WWW. I do have a portable Progressive surge protector and was going to go on my own. i just wanted to make sure I am 100% right before I do something stupid. Thanks.

I will post pics in my album later this week. I have a ton of things stockpiled waiting for the bird. TPMS, Multi traffic camera system and a Silverleaf VMSpc (and more) sitting. I have the dealer doing tires, air bags, and spring cans. They are meeting me half way with those. They did the radiator, and the hydronic heating system and I am grateful for that.

Future plan are a birds nest (this winter), slowly treating the rusty frame and sealing it. Solar and 100 Ah LiFePO4 12 Volt Deep Cycle house batteries. Safe T Plus steering control coming soon too.
You are on the right track Chris. Only thing to note is that its a 50 amp, 2 pole, single phase connection. 2 phase is not generally used, I have been an industrial electrician for 20 years and have never seen 2 phase power in use. Also I would just make sure that the panel you are connecting to is the main house panel and not a subpanel. This is where the nuetral and ground connections are more important. As others have stated, once you are past the main panel the nuetral and ground need to stay seperated, they are only bonded (connected together) at the main panel. Hope this helps. If you need any more help feel free to contact me via pm and I will be willing to help you over the phone if you want some advice.
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  #88  
Old 06-16-2019
ChrisRasman ChrisRasman is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mahansm View Post
Your diagram for wiring the 120/240 50a power receptacle is correct. However, if I were doing it (and I did...) I'd use #6 copper for the 2 hot leads and the neutral. The ground lead doesn't have to be any thicker than #12, although I ran #8 to the outlet on the side of my house (about 2 feet). The hot leads are connected to the terminals of a dual 50 amp 120 volt breaker; the ground and neutral both connect to the common bus in my service entry panel.



The neutral and ground conductors should only be bonded at the service entrance with driven ground rods. Any sub panel fed from the main panel should have separate ground and neutral buses. The neutral bus should be isolated from the box and the ground bus connected to the (metal) box.
Thanks!

I was going to run it from a 100 amp sub panel I have in my work shop. Then I thought about bonded grounds. I will run it from my main house panel. My only problem now is , I may have to run a 50 foot UF to a post out in the back corner of the lot.

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Southwir...2722/300916640

I am in a small development. Thankfully the HOA went away in the 70s. It is now part of the unincorporated county. I can only park my WL in or out. I have less than an acre. I decide to park it in so the windshield is not close to the street. considering my situation, I think putting in a ground rod at the pedestal is prudent. If I backed it in, the shore power cable would be right behind my main panel.
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  #89  
Old 06-16-2019
mahansm mahansm is offline
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Feeding the 50 amp receptacle from the sub panel is fine. Just be careful to keep ground and neutral separate and be sure that the ground conductor has continuity all the way back to the main panel. Hot skin is a bad thing and can happen if the ground conductor is not connected properly.


The cable referenced is adequate for the use intended. When measuring the cable length required be sure to include the vertical runs to the panels on each end and allow some extra length for routing the longest connection inside the panel. 24" is standard minimum required depth for direct burial of UF-B. This is the cable I used (same brand, even...) to feed the sub-panel in my backyard shed; I may at some point in the future install an additional 50 amp receptacle on the wall of that shed.


If you decide to hook to your sub panel instead please check the wire size feeding it and the breaker size in the main panel to avoid overloads.
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  #90  
Old 06-16-2019
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Bill Pape Bill Pape is offline
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There are confusing posts on Bluebird Buddy plugs,
for powering up other RV's when dry camping,
and powering up a house panel during power outages.
Do the electricians want to post the instruction for the proper safe hook-ups?
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