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Engine Discussion of preventative/corrective maintenance and other technical issues regarding your coach's engine.

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  #11  
Old 11-17-2008
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warbucks13477 warbucks13477 is offline
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I am still learning about the 4 cycle Detroit Diesels so am going to approach this by asking a question and not stating any facts (since I dont have any?). But are all of you using synthetic oils in the DD that are API licensed and meet the performance and Chemical requirements outlined in the DD publication I posted previously? In other words are you all using synthetic engine oils approved by DD?
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Tom Warner
Vernon Center,NY
1985 PT40 SOLD
6V92
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  #12  
Old 11-17-2008
davidmbrady
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Hi Tom,

Absolutely, here's a list of them:

http://preview.tinyurl.com/5uvoqn

David Brady
'02 LXi, NC
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  #13  
Old 11-17-2008
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I understand David but what are YOU using in your BB series 60?

Do you realize that Mobil Delvac Super 1300 actually tested higher against Amsoil synthetic then Mobil 1? Big big price difference. Have you ever tried it?
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Vernon Center,NY
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6V92
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  #14  
Old 11-17-2008
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Thanks David,

Another folder for the PT42 Files

Kurt Hovath
95 PT 42
10AC
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  #15  
Old 11-17-2008
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Wink power

First acceleration on the 8v92 seemed to hesitate and start slow. But once it reached rpms or about 30 or so yards, the power would kick in and I would catch the car in front. The Series 60 seems to get off the line without the hesitation, but then the power does not kick in as with the 8v92. After driving the 2000 for 2 months, I drove the 94 and was amazed at how fast I got up to 60mph. However, I did have a leak in my after cooler. I had it fixed and everyone said I would see an increase in power, which I never did. In my humble opinion, the 8v92 has more overall power. My valves have not been adjusted, which may account for this. You have motivated me to spend the $500-$600 for a tune up and valve adjustment.

However, my 8v92 got 5.1 to 5.2 mpg no matter what. Tow a car, climb a mountain, run 80mph, run 50 mph, it was going to get 5.2 mpg. I was getting 5.0 mpg, then I started adding transmission fluid to the diesel and my mileage picked up. However, I never added the 1 to 3 qts. of transmission fluid to the quantity of diesel when computing mileage.

The series 60 mileage varies tremendiously. I took a trip to Titusville (700 miles), towing, 55 mph, and got 6.6 mpg. The trip to Perry through Bainbridge, towing, 55 mph and got 6.2 mpg (very hilly between Fl and Bainbridge). I found that it shifts into 6th gear at 53 mph and that is where I get my best mileage. On a trip to the mountains, towing, 60mph, I usually get 5.8mpg or so. The 2000 coach is heavier than the 94, so I may not be comparing apples to apples. I ferried a 95 Prevo for a friend last week and It had a lot more power at take off than my coach. Once it reached about 30 or so mph, it felt as though the power quit. The Prevo just floats whereas the Bird is a firm ride.

I am going to get a tune up.

rr
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Vintage Birds

1994 Wanderlodge (sold)
2000 LXI (sold)
1993 Wanderlodge(Sold)
2004 M380
Blountstown, Florida
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  #16  
Old 11-17-2008
BCRoamer BCRoamer is offline
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Here's my experience with the difference in performance and mileage between an 8V and a 60 series. Until my back injury in 2006 we ran with a group of 4 Prevost's all over the west coast and to Alaska. One of the Prevost was a '03 Marathon 40 ft with no slides. This gave me a fair comparision altough our Bird was significant heavier and they towed a CVR vrs our MDX.

In '98 I had DD Albany install what they call a "hot rod" kit for my 8V, primary change is to run the supercharger at 2X crankshaft speed rather than the standard 0.5X. There are some other DDEC and ADEC changes also.

Anyway this resolved by coming off the line with any "heavy" coach. In normal traffic, pulling a toad I can keep up with traffic and in many cases have to back off. My friend and I have done a flat out "drag" race for dinner, 0 t 60. We were out in the middle of the Mojace Desert so there was no safety issue. When I hit 60 he was at least 4 bus lengths behind.

On our trip to Alaska none of the other coaches ever outpulled me on a hill. My engine rebuilt has low mileage and the supercharger and turbocharger are in very good shape. I have the valves set whenever my normal shiftpoint drops below 21" of boost. Under a very hard and long pull in 3rd gear I have seen boost of 28+".

Mileage issues for me a are lot as described by another Owner here. If I drive right at the top of the cruise-control (~77 mph), run the gen , dash a/c and pull my toad I get 5.2. If I drop down into the mid 60's, no gen, no dash a/c I can push that to the very high 5's.

One big advantage of the 60's is that they have the 6 speed tran. It appears that 6th gear is an over-drive one-step above my 5th gear. When we start pulling hills and comparing PRM's it appears the lower 5 gears are very smiliar in both tran.

So, when we're pulling hills and drop a gear or two it gets down to HP/torq and my coach wins.

There is nothing here to suggest that there something is wrong with the 60 series, it's a great engine. The point is that the old 8V92 was/is also a great engine and can hold it's own against some of the newer stuff.

NOW, I have also run with some of the 600+ HP coaches, they flat run away from me.
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  #17  
Old 11-17-2008
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With my '95, S-60, I'll get around 5 mpg most of the time while traveling in the west. I noticed that I've been getting better while traveling in the east (just ran down from Scranton, PA parallel to the Blue Ridge Parkway ... then west to Nashville where we took the Natchez trace. During part of that trip we were getting 6 mpg or better. On the Natchez Trace Parkway (with a 50 mph speed limit most of the way), it looks like we were getting in the high 6s (but my fill up included a 'hot' run along several Interstates at 70 mph that brought the overall fill up on that run to about 6.1). I'm also running the generator while on the road to keep the home-style refrigerator going -- I lost an inverter that I'll deal with after I get home in December.

I haven't had a "tune up" and I don't know if the P.O. did either. So, one may be due. The flatter landscape east of the Rockies is clearly improving the fuel use -- but only by 10 to 15 percent as best I can tell. I usually cruise at about 65 on freeways -- but if pressed for time will roll it up to 70 if conditions (and speed limits) permit.

I like the idea of going faster in a tail wind ... and I wonder exactly what the impact of the 'tail end' of Ike was... we were driving (across Ohio) with a cross wind with gusts up to 70 mph. Too bad it wasn't a tail wind. I probably could have cruised at 80 and gotten 10 mpg! (Unfortunately, with that cross wind, it was a heck of a lot of work just keeping the bus on the road. Cross winds don't usually cause me much trouble -- and it was only after we were "in" for the night when I saw a weather report describing the winds we'd experienced.)
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Ridgefield, WA
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  #18  
Old 11-17-2008
BCRoamer BCRoamer is offline
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Remember; the same guy the designed the brick designed the BlueBird. One nice thing is that it's asymetrical as far as the wind is concerned.

I've driven in nearly every possible condidition you can think of and all things considered the Bird handle them with ease. Worst case was going west across Neb witha 75 mph wind coming out of the northwest, right on the corner.

Even then I felt completely safe and in control.
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1993 WB #104663 (SOLD)
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  #19  
Old 11-17-2008
davidmbrady
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I find that the bus, sans toad, handles beautifully under all conditions including high, high winds. When I hook up the car, then things get dicey in high winds. The cure - slow down. I tow a '96 Honda Pilot, one of the best toads I've had, but it too is a bit of a brick and when the wind hits it, I can feel it tugging at the back of the coach.

By all means, get a tune-up, guaranteed to increase your fuel mileage.

David Brady
'02 LXi, NC
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  #20  
Old 11-17-2008
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I never notice my toad, a 1993 Toyota Camry. Doesn't seem to have any effect on the handling of the coach. The only winds that I ever seriously felt, while underway, were the 70+ mph crosswind associated with Hurricane Ike as its remains wandered across Ohio and Pennsylvania. It was a bit of work maintaining my lane -- and (very disturbing) the small window awnings on the windward side started unravelling and rewinding themselves every so often. When I stopped and opened the door to take a look, a wind gust caught it and pulled me out of the coach.

Yes, once I realized just how bad the winds were, I slowed down. I could hold 55 or so without serious wind effects -- but above 60, it would start to get rather noticeable. It most reminded me of driving my '69 VW Bus on the Bayshore freeway during a heavy storm -- you don't steer, you tack....

Obviously, the "brick" aerodynamics were a factor. Usually, the weight of the 'bird keeps it from being too upset by winds ... but unusually strong winds will affect all tall, flat-sided vehicles. (It was pretty obvious, too, that many of the trucks were fighting the wind.) I frankly didn't realize just how fast the winds were, until I attempted my outside inspection and got flipped 10' from the front door of the coach. Now, THAT was an experience.

I'll check into the tune-up for my next major servicing. I wouldn't mind a little improvement.
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Ridgefield, WA
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