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Tires, Wheels, Brakes, Steering and Suspensions Discussion of preventative/corrective maintenance and other technical issues regarding your coach's Tires, Wheels, Brakes, Steering and Suspensions and related components.

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  #1  
Old 03-04-2018
jcs707's Avatar
jcs707 jcs707 is offline
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Default Losing Jake after switch mod

Late last summer George M. modded my jake 'enable' with a 3-way which now adds the 'only on with brake' mode. The next trip I took (to WOG) I lost my jake about 5 miles up the road from Pine Mtn. Since then I've lost it another 4 times. I had never lost my jake before the mod, neither had Ron when he owned the bus. A reset always clears the problem.

So far, I'm pretty sure that each failure happened when I was in the default zero throttle mode. Since this problem started right after the mod, I never felt comfortable with experimenting with the 'only on with brake' mode. Also, I always leave the jake selector on high.

George says it's probably the TPS. I have a spare (new) and I'm willing to go down that path, but I just wanted to see if there are other thoughts on this.

One thing I should have done when it happened today is to see if Allison is downshifting to it's pre-select (5th) when I lift off the throttle. I didn't think to do that, but I'm almost positive I didn't feel it downshift after I lost the jake.

If it IS NOT downshifting ...would that point to a bad TPS?
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Clint & Tammy Summers
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2000 LXI SS "Piper"
1977 FC 31 RB "BUSTA BUS"
1995 WB 42 "The Magic Carpet" sold

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  #2  
Old 03-05-2018
Flyfisher Flyfisher is offline
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Quote:
If it IS NOT downshifting ...would that point to a bad TPS?
Good question, in the throttle actuated Jake mode you can partially lift your foot off the throttle and the transmission will downshift to the preselect gear and the Jake will not come on. When you completely lift your foot off the throttle the both actions occur. The TPS has to go to zero for this to happen. But is a failed TPS the only thing that would cause the transmission not to downshift to the preselect gear? I don't know, the TCM controls this function, but I would rule out the TPS question by taking Georges advice and changing it then go for a ride. Otherwise it might be a trip to the Allison Service Center for a diagnostic check up and cha-ching, cha-ching will result. In your case WW Williams on the south side of Atlanta, which I had the pleasure of visiting one time for a TPS problem. Great shop, good people and they know their stuff.

Since George has been involved I assume your bus no longer has the 22C relay in the BB control circuit which causes intermittent Jake operation, he would have spotted that immediately. Been down that road too. The brake actuated Jake mod is nothing more than a three position switch and about six feet of wire. Since George modified mine I drive the bus 90% of time in the brake actuated mode, it works great.
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  #3  
Old 03-05-2018
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Ed Wimberley Ed Wimberley is offline
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Location: Perry Georgia
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Clint
Same mod on ours also by George. No problem in 7,000 miles.
Do you lose it in brake only mode or zero throttle mode?
Zero throttle on ours works the same as before if on cruise Jake will come on going down hill to slow coach as it speeds up going downhill.
Brake only Jake only comes on if brake is applied and stays on until throttle reapplied.
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  #4  
Old 03-05-2018
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Mallie Lennon Mallie Lennon is offline
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Could be as simple as a bad switch of a loose connection.
But the sw just changes the input from ignition to brake light.
It should function exactly the same in both modes when you touch the brake, as you foot is already completely off the accelerator at that point.
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  #5  
Old 03-05-2018
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I have the mod done on my coach,Joe Garner did mine,theres a thread somewhere.
But i did have some of the same issues,before and after the mod,i changed the TPS and cured the problems.
I also had a problem with my cruise control dropping out,the Pro Driver would show a TPS fault when that happened,a blip on the screen,you had to be quick to see it.

One word of advice,when you change the TPS get some new screws,allen headed,so you can use an allen wrench to change them next time.
And,just for fun i plugged the new TPS in to the harness before mounting it,the TPS needs a little preload on it,just plugging it in will result in no idle,but you can use a screwdriver to bring the idle up and rev the engine up.
By inserting the screwdriver in the slot on the tps.
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  #6  
Old 03-05-2018
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Ed Wimberley Ed Wimberley is offline
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The mod is primarily to stop Jake activation when in cruise mode.
Yes if brake applied it first drops out of cruise then "0" position on throttle will activate Jake.
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  #7  
Old 03-05-2018
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jcs707 jcs707 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mallie Lennon View Post
Could be as simple as a bad switch of a loose connection.
.
Yea, that was my concern in that something in the new switch or the new connection could be loose and intermittenly removing input power 'while the jake is active' ... which would make the jake go away until a reset.


@Randy - regarding those screws ... I hear those are a bi$5h! Would something like this work?.
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__________________
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Clint & Tammy Summers
Atlanta GA / Lenior City TN

2000 LXI SS "Piper"
1977 FC 31 RB "BUSTA BUS"
1995 WB 42 "The Magic Carpet" sold

Semper Fi
----------------------------------------------------
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  #8  
Old 03-05-2018
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Randy Dupree Randy Dupree is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jcs707 View Post
Yea, that was my concern in that something in the new switch or the new connection could be loose and intermittenly removing input power 'while the jake is active' ... which would make the jake go away until a reset.


@Randy - regarding those screws ... I hear those are a bi$5h! Would something like this work?.
Yes,those will work,but as you know getting a tight Philips screw out when you can't get leverage on is tough.
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  #9  
Old 03-05-2018
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Mallie Lennon Mallie Lennon is offline
1995 WB 42’ Series 60
 
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The phillips screws are easy to get out if you know how. Your Phillips probably will not do it, mine would not.
but you can pull the rubber off the peddle, then you can get a pair of water pump pliers in the side of the screws to loosen them.

Click image for larger version

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The new screws that came with mine had torx head.
It also comes with a converter cable to make it fit you old connnection


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I got mine from findit part
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  #10  
Old 03-05-2018
Randy Dupree's Avatar
Randy Dupree Randy Dupree is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mallie Lennon View Post
The phillips screws are easy to get out if you know how. Your Phillips probably will not do it, mine would not.
but you can pull the rubber off the peddle, then you can get a pair of water pump pliers in the side of the screws to loosen them.

Attachment 54260

The new screws that came with mine had torx head.
It also comes with a converter cable to make it fit you old connnection


Attachment 54261



I got mine from findit part
I remember you posting that before,using the pliers.
I got allen heads anyway,allen wrenches are easy to find in a 90 degree configuration.
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