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BMC (Bluebird Motor Coach Unique Issues) If you have a unique issue with your BMC coach and it can't be answered in one of the other forums here, then this is where you can list it.....List your BMC Parts here too.

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  #1  
Old 02-12-2010
AC7880 AC7880 is offline
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Default Recommendations for boost/pyro gauges?

I've been googling looking for what boost/pyro gauges to get, and figured I'd ask if any one has good sources/packages.

Has anyone used the digital X-Monitor - Boost/Pyro - Dash Top / Universal http://www.shopatron.com/products/pr...170.1001.20172?

I found a pyro with 50' of wiring at: http://www.shopatron.com/products/ca...0161.20167.0.0 in black or white face. I prefer the white face, because the black face is color marked for safe temps - and don't match Cummins 8.3 temps.

Any body else have a recommendation for other gauges/sources with 50' wire/tubing setup?
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  #2  
Old 02-13-2010
AC7880 AC7880 is offline
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One electronic signal processor in engine compartment, and then 3 wires to the front for both the boost and egt gauge (or up to 17 gauges total). Under the "hood", the boost and pyro go into the signal processor, then that feeds data forward to the gauges.
http://www.isspro.com/Performax_L/PERFORMAX_ARTICLE.pdf

I emailed isspro a bunch of questions about this to see if it will work with the need for about 60' of wiring total to get from back to front, plus side runs etc. If it will work reliably with this length run, it's easier to run 3 wires total, than boost tubing and pyro wiring.
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  #3  
Old 02-13-2010
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rwoody rwoody is offline
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isspro is a great gauge

i want to see what you get ..i might just do mine the same

they make a dual gauge so you can read both on the same gauge

i need that style on my new to me diesel ford truck
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  #4  
Old 02-15-2010
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I called ISSPRO and talked to tech. The engineer is out of town, but they are contacting him, then getting back to me.

Tech says use one of the vendors once they (ISSPRO) recommend pieces parts to me.

I want a 0-40 psi boost gauge, and a 0-1600 degree egt/pyro gauge with a 1/4" (versus 1/8") thermocouple. Stock lower dash gauges are black face and rim, white needle. The 2 new gauges will go in a pod above the driver. I also want the optional dimmer pot.

I found a pod for $10 at http://www.glowshiftdirect.com/Unive...-Dash-Pod.aspx (No room in my dash for two more gauges - only one)

For 2 gauges, it looks like EV2 will be cheaper than Performax, but means running 3 wires for the boost and 2 lead wires for the egt. Performax will mean running 3 wires total forward after mounting the ESP under the rear hood. I don't see a problem with the extra wires (5 vs 3) for the run as long as I can get the proper wires.

On either boost gauge, there is no vacum tubing - it is all electronic.

Tech at ISSPRO does not see a problem with either EV2 or Performax, and says ISSPRO can provide the wire for the long run, and thermocouple long lead wire for egt - but he wants engineer to verify.

Coach is 38' long, plus up to 2 8' side runs, plus up to 2 8' verticle runs. That means max wire runs of 70', likely more like 50-60 ft - but better too much wire than not enough.

Once ISSPRO gets back to me I will order thru one of the vendors on diesel bombers.

diesel Bombers has a section where you post on what you want to buy - then vendors bid on it with you via a private message. Have 5 vendors interested in bidding on the gauges and parts for me.
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Old 02-15-2010
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Lee Davis Lee Davis is offline
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Default Gauges

Dan,

This sounds pretty complicated to me. Is this something a guy who is not a gearhead but a little handy can do. Or do you get someone to do this?

Looks like having the gauges before doing other stuff would be a good idea.
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  #6  
Old 02-16-2010
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Lee,

I'll be doing it myself. On the ISSPRO site pick the gauges you want (colors etc).

At this point I think I'm going to go EV2. I'll need them to provide extra long wiring for both gauges from sensors in the back to gauges in the front.

On the ISSPRO site pick out your gauge style preference - note the part no, then click on installation, then part no. They have install notes on line.

EV2 black face white needle gauges:
Pyro, 0 - 1600 degrees part R16021
Boost 0 - 40 psi R16333
Dimmer pot option part no R72022

Performax black face white needle:
Pyro, 0 - 1600 degrees part R590211
Boost 0 - 40 psi R59333
Dimmer pot option part no ??
Elec Sig Processor R8200

If you are good with wiring runs and 12 volt wiring, no need to hire it out.

Drilling and tapping the exhaust manifold for the thermocouple (egt sensor) is one hard part - I hired that out since I was at Brazels anyway. I had them tap 1/4" npt - turns out ISSPRO mainly uses 1/8" npt, but they say they can do 1/4" as well by special order. Tech at Brazel's left a capped "T" he used on a turbo line for dyno testing that I can tap into for the boost gauge.

Next hard part is the wiring run. I went under the coach and thru the bays when I did my toad braking system from front to back. Since my campground is so soggy wet and muddy, and I don't have jackstands anymore, I will likely run the wiring on the inside of the coach through the wiring runs in the back of the cabinets from back of coach to front of coach. Other than that, it is tapping the gauges into wire hot on ignition, one for dimming dash lights, one ground.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee Davis View Post
Dan,

This sounds pretty complicated to me. Is this something a guy who is not a gearhead but a little handy can do. Or do you get someone to do this?

Looks like having the gauges before doing other stuff would be a good idea.
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Last edited by AC7880; 03-09-2010 at 03:31 PM.
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  #7  
Old 02-16-2010
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Dan, check these out

http://www.westach.com/gauge_images/2DC2-30SS.jpg

http://www.maperformance.com/msdegt-gauge-2-1-16.html

http://www.pegasusautoracing.com/pro...asp?RecId=5976

Peace&Love, Darren
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  #8  
Old 02-16-2010
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Dan this sounds like a great project for the BMC guys.

I have not chimed in about the guages as I have the Banks set and they are installed in the same area as Bruce Cameron's.



I look forward to your installation.

Good work going on here.
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  #9  
Old 03-09-2010
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I went with the ISSPRO EV2 boost and egt gauges mentioned above in the thread. The boost gauge works from 3 wires versus vacumn tubing - and made the job easier for me. Boost is 3 seperate wires, egt is a jacketed outter covering with a metal internal shielding (like a coax shielding material) over 2 coated wires, and one bare grounding wire.

I found a dual gauge pod for $10 at http://www.glowshiftdirect.com/Unive...-Dash-Pod.aspx that looks and functions fine.

Fully loaded my rig is 33,000 lbs, pulling 3500 lbs of tow car with a Cummins 8.3 mechanical 300 hp with #10 fuel plate, star wheel turned up, high flow muffler - could get pretty hot pulling long mountain grades in summer (which is why I'm adding the gauges). I'll likely advance the timing from 12 degrees now to 15 degrees later.

I received the 2 gauges, the boost and egt sensors, 75' of wiring, and an optional dimmer function pot to adjust the pod brightness seperately from the dash gauges. Total for all shipped to me was $452. The factory 75' of wiring for the 2 gauges was a good chunk of change just by itself - but should ensure good data versus if I jury rigged my own wiring.

Everything ISSPRO shipped was great except the egt sensor was still the 1/8" NPT that is their standard instead of the 1/4" I requested. I already had a 1/4" tap in place for the egt, and the boost tap in place as well.

I used a brass 1/4 to 1/8" adapter for egt in the exhaust manifold for now, but ordered a stainless steel one on the net to swap out later. Even though I don't plan to run over 1300 degrees by much or often, the melting point of brass of 1652-1724 degrees makes me wonder about it holding up over time - stainless is good to 2500 degrees, so Ill swap them out when the SS adapter arrives. SS adapter: http://www.buyfittingsonline.com/Fittings/item7141.htm

The boost sensor is at passenger side mid engine by the fuel solonoid and pump, the egt sensor is more on the drivers side directly under the exhaust manifold pre-turbo. I routed the wires for both over to drivers side by the engine coolant surge tank, to then go upward into the bedroom of the coach. I used about 5' more on the boost wires than on the egt wires to get to this merging point.

From the point where the wires meet by the surge tank, I taped the two gauges wiring packages together every 3 feet to tie them toegther into one wiring package to route up to the dash of the coach.

Normally I run wiring on a motorhome under the chassis, but I am in a campground on the WA coast where the ground is wet and muddy and soft. My motorhome sits low on air suspension, and I didn't trust the hydraulic jacks alone to raise it to crawl under. I sold my heavy jacks and stands when I started to full time travel.

So for this project I ran the wiring up from the engine compartment by the surge tank, upward through a hole I drilled into the interior of the drivers side rear of the motorhome as the easiest point to enter. Wires enter the coach in the rear of the cabinet at bed side rear, go up 6' inside a cabinet behind the power circuit breakers, into the overhead cabinets hidden wiring runs. Next across the top cabinets in the wiring runs to right rear 8', forward to right front 38', down to front lower right dash 5', and across to left front 8' where I mounted the gauges.

I used nearly the entire 75' of wiring to do this. With where I placed the boost sensor in the engine compartment, I had 1' to spare on boost wiring, and about 5' to spare on pyro wiring.

The wiring run was a real pain, removing everything from cabinets, removing a ton of screws to get to the wiring runs, using a push pull guide wire to get through a couple spots of over 4', then reassembling cabinet wiring runs and putting everything back in the cabinets.

A drivers side wiring run would have used less wire, but I had a spot I could not get a wire pull though from the washer/dryer closet, past the shower, past the fridge, past the microwave - so I ended up with a longer wiring run on the passenger side for easier wiring pulls and runs.

Not a job I would want to do very often for sure. I fired the Cummins up in neutral at a standstill, and the boost and pyro seem to be reading fine. I won't be on the road until mid April to really find out my normal boost and pyro readings, and won't pull mountain grades until about mid May. I should be going over the North Cascades Hiway then - a good test of temps and boost under tough conditions.

The vendor I used was GOSperformance http://www.gosperformance.com/ with Aden as my point of contact, and he had ISSPRO direct ship to me. Since a motorhome is a non standard wiring setup for ISSPRO, it may help to have Aden to order for you if you decide to do a similar project.
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Last edited by AC7880; 03-09-2010 at 10:57 PM.
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  #10  
Old 03-09-2010
AC7880 AC7880 is offline
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Couple of pics:

Entering the bedroom from the engine,
upright run behind breakers,
up to overheads,
overhead runs,
gauges left of dash:
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